HAMMONTON BLOG

Admin · Status: Offline

Mayor & Council to add more to our debt.

Date: 07:35 AM Jan 19, 2008

The website is funny. Jim MacLane voted to increase taxes EVERY YEAR he was in office. He didn\'t miss one. In addition, he was part of the team that DOUBLED Hammonton\'s debt in one project. Thanks, Jim, but I like the people who have had zero tax increases two years in a row and are working towards three in a row.

Donkeyfan · Status: Offline

Mr. Anonymous,

I love how when you don't like the question you attack the questioner. That's the Hammonton First way. I am going to let you in on a secret: Jim Maclane is not in office anymore. But Mayor Johnny Flash and his Bullies of Bellevue Ave are.

Do you deny that under this Mayor's admnistration that the debt doubled from $13 million (2005) to $25 million (2007)? Don't attack me, don't attack Jim. Just answer the question. Don't change the subject!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Admin · Status: Offline

Anonymous wrote:

The website is funny. Jim MacLane voted to increase taxes EVERY YEAR he was in office. He didn\'t miss one. In addition, he was part of the team that DOUBLED Hammonton\'s debt in one project. Thanks, Jim, but I like the people who have had zero tax increases two years in a row and are working towards three in a row.

Sounds like you are against the education of our children. I guess you figure you got your education so the heck with everyone else. It is a well known fact throughout the state by all informed and intellectual voters that the failure of the state government to follow state law and properly fund education caused tax increases in almost every municipality in the state. And it has also been proven that Hammonton was hit harder than most districts in the State. I had a responsibility to both the children and the taxpayers and I stand by my votes as I feel I balanced my responsibilities to both sides well.
I was not part of the team that doubled Hammonton's debt, I came on the board after the referendum. I was part of the team that built the project and insured that it came in on time and on budget.
You need to look at how this current "team" is getting you those zero tax increases. They are using the Town's debt to finance the projects. They are using credit card spending to keep from funding everthing they do. Look at the agenda for Monday night's meeting, they are bonding $21,375 just so they won't have to use the regular budget. We are going to have to start paying back this debt very soon and that is going to hit us hard. This Town needs to change it's management style right now before people start losing their homes.

Donkeyfan · Status: Offline

Jim,
We are just wasting our typing trying to convince the Bullies of Bellevue of the problem of debt. They run the town the way they run their businesses. Debt, Debt, Debt.

I realize that reading is not their strong suit. Why clutter your mind with the facts that get in the way of things? On the agenda, the Mayor's brother is being allowed to reduce his bond on one of his developments. So as real estate implodes all around us, Mayor Johnny Flash is letting bro Steve's developments take out less risk insurance.

Who did the risk assessment? The financial oversight committee, led by brother #3, Don DiDonato.

Date: 04:46 PM Jan 19, 2008

Donkeyfan wrote:
Mr. Anonymous,

I love how when you don't like the question you attack the questioner. That's the Hammonton First way. I am going to let you in on a secret: Jim Maclane is not in office anymore. But Mayor Johnny Flash and his Bullies of Bellevue Ave are.

Do you deny that under this Mayor's admnistration that the debt doubled from $13 million (2005) to $25 million (2007)? Don't attack me, don't attack Jim. Just answer the question. Don't change the subject!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I agree. We should not change the subject. It's about debt. In 2005, the last council with a majority of R's and D's raised the debt from $12 million to almost $19 million. Now HF lowered debt down by over half a million dollars. That is the data from the town's independent auditors and includes the debt factored in for town hall. And HF didn't raise taxes.

Date: 05:14 PM Jan 19, 2008

Admin, maybe the reason things never got done in the past was the old leaders kept flip-flopping. Just the other day, under "Hammonton Airport may get an upgrade." you wrote that this was "good news for the Town of Hammonton."

You also wrote that "The Airport could become a recurring source of income for the Town, allowing for fewer taxes."

Finally, you wrote "we do not need to turn it into a beuracratic nightmare with delay after delay. We have already seen that in our Town and we know what that brought us."

The Mayor got a $450,000 grant from the Federal Government for this. The local property taxpayers only have to pay 5% of this, the Feds pay everything else. You realize that this will generate income for the town. Why would you bash this and get things to slow down. As you said, we saw in the past the problems in Hammonton with delay after delay. The Mayor is moving forward.

In 2005, the year before HF came to office, the town added almost $7 million in debt. Why didn't you yell about that back then? HF has been paying off debt. Shouldn't this be a case where we do want to move forward with the project?

Admin · Status: Offline

First of all, in no way am I bashing this project. I have offered a different way of funding the project without incurring more debt. Are you really trying to give the impression that unless you blindly follow and do things exactly the way the Mayor proposes you are bashing. I support the Mayor and Council in providing upgrades to the airport. This is a good thing for our Town, however, I do not want to see the debt continue to climb.
Second, this grant has been in the works for quite some time. Yes it is being put into play during John's term, but even he isn't taking all of the credit for this grant.
Third, Yes there was a drop of $500,000 but those figures are quoted from the end of 2006. During 2007 the debt has skyrocketed to $25,000,000. we need to change the way we are doing things. We can all work together to make this happen instead of you guys bashing me and ignoring the problem. Let's work together. I have sent the Mayor several emails offering to help in any way I can and even asked to be placed on certain committees and he won't even respond to me. Is this the same guy who looks into the TV camera each month asking us to work together?

Date: 06:23 PM Jan 19, 2008

At least we both agree that debt went down by over $500,000 during the first year HF was in office.

Now you claim that the debt went up by $7M in 2007. Why don't you list the items that caused that $7M. Note that I think where you are doing your estimates wrong is with Town hall. That was already factored in for the 2006 audit. Whenever a town starts a project, even if the project isn't completed, the full amount of the bond ordinance has to be included in the town's debt. Go ahead and check yourself.

Yes, there is a debt of $21K that was taken on by the town to get the $450K federal grant for the airport. That's a pretty good deal for the town.

Admin · Status: Offline

Pages from the same audit you qoute from indicate otherwise. There are almost $7 million in bonds not issued yet. Click here to see the pages from the audit.

Admin · Status: Offline

And the attitude that you take concerning adding to the debt is obviously the same attitude taken by Mayor and Council. It is that approach to funding the projects of our Town that is causing this runaway credit card spending. All debts come due in time and when ours come due we are in big trouble. You are just postponing the inevitable. Let's use the money from the unexpected income from the ACIA Pooled Loan Program and stop this runaway train now.

Donkeyfan · Status: Offline

HF-idiots,
Who are you fooling?
The debt decrease of $500,000 was due to the fact the debt simply mature. Your Bullies of Bellevue happen to be sitting in office when this happened.

However, when they got their greasy paws really into running the town, the increased the debt by $14 million.

So, let me ask the question in words even you can understand....

Do you agree that $14 million is less than $500,000? If you agree with that, will you admit for the readers that HF raised the debt $13.5 million. Don't blame the GOP, the Dems, jim Maclane or the late Anthony Ingemi.

Date: 07:54 AM Jan 20, 2008

HF idiots,
We have calculated the new debt of Hammonton has gone over $1 Billion! That is right! It is over $1 billion! Look at how the Dems calculated the school came in "on time and on budget." The fact that the taxes at the school skyrocketed doesn't matter! The Dems have to be right.

The auditors who told you there were millions of dollars in leasing at the school had to be wrong! Never mind that you taxes went up like crazy.

The Democrats now cannot show how their debt calculations add up and no auditor agrees with them. But that is okay! Ignore the facts and ignore the independent auditor! Ignore that since HF has come to office the town taxes haven't been raised and even the school had zero last year. We won't get fooled again!

Date: 08:04 AM Jan 20, 2008

Anonymous wrote:
HF idiots,
We have calculated the new debt of Hammonton has gone over $1 Billion! That is right! It is over $1 billion! Look at how the Dems calculated the school came in "on time and on budget." The fact that the taxes at the school skyrocketed doesn't matter! The Dems have to be right.

The auditors who told you there were millions of dollars in leasing at the school had to be wrong! Never mind that you taxes went up like crazy.

The Democrats now cannot show how their debt calculations add up and no auditor agrees with them. But that is okay! Ignore the facts and ignore the independent auditor! Ignore that since HF has come to office the town taxes haven't been raised and even the school had zero last year. We won't get fooled again!

Maybe we need a nice letter by the Democrats in the papers to discuss the debt and detail their calculations. That would be nice. Yes, the Dems should definately detail that in a letter for everyone in Hammonton to see. Speak out against HF! Yeah!

By the way, why weren't the Dems screaming from the highest mountain when the debt went up by over 50% in 2005, the YEAR BEFORE hf came to office?

By the way, exactly how much did the school cost to build? Can anyone have an audited report?

Date: 09:57 AM Jan 20, 2008

hey donkey fan or should i say just donkey you r a ass. first bonds go down as the project closes out. it's all under the supervision of arh. it happens every day not just for the mayors bro. 2nd if the debt did go up from 18 to 25 for then town hall what would have it gone up under the old m and c on 11th st. plus we would have had high tax increases to. hf has brought a new word to the m and c responsibility. you should have tried it over at the 33 million dollar on time and under budget new orleans style abortion you built. that you call the high school . the old saying is true . why don't you try to join them because you will not beat them. three in a row it's all good. hey is that my new tax bill wow.

Date: 12:29 PM Jan 20, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

why don't you try to join them because you will not beat them. three in a row it's all good. hey is that my new tax bill wow.

Your guys got smoked by Bertino, Marino, and Vitalo.

I've already heard on the street you guys plan on running Rodio, Sparacino, and that other one again. WHAT A JOKE! You're going to get smoked out again!

You got lucky one year.

Oh by the way, I heard one of the Hammonton First councilmen called to complain that the flags were flying half-mast for Anthony Ingemi and noone "called the governer" to get it approved. Tell that piece of you-know-what he's a no-class jack--- that could never, NEVER, walk in Anthony's footsteps.

one and done fools. the train is a-coming. the crossroads are here.

Admin · Status: Offline

Anonymous wrote:

HF idiots,
We have calculated the new debt of Hammonton has gone over $1 Billion! That is right! It is over $1 billion! Look at how the Dems calculated the school came in "on time and on budget." The fact that the taxes at the school skyrocketed doesn't matter! The Dems have to be right. Why can't you guys just talk facts and try to understand. The debt is not $1 billion it is now about $25 million. And yes, the school project did come in on time and on budget and the auditors have already agreed to that. The Governor and the Dept of Education have told you why the taxes went up all throughout the state, it had nothing to do with the new high school.

The auditors who told you there were millions of dollars in leasing at the school had to be wrong! Never mind that you taxes went up like crazy. The auditors never said there was millions of dollars in leasing. The only thing that was lease purchased for the building project were the new computers for the high school, it would not have made any sense to charge the computers to a 30 year bond because they certainly would have been obsolete long before we would have paid for them. That plan was put in place by the Board before me that also put together the high school referendum.

The Democrats now cannot show how their debt calculations add up and no auditor agrees with them. But that is okay! Ignore the facts and ignore the independent auditor! Ignore that since HF has come to office the town taxes haven't been raised and even the school had zero last year. We won't get fooled again! The figures have been shown here and other websites many times, you just choose not to see them. The figures came from the same audit that you hold up as showing the decrease in debt. You have to read much further into the audit on page 116 to see the additional debt the Town still needed to sell bonds for. Click here to see the audit report. We certainly are not ignoring the facts, we are pointing out that we have had a zero tax increase because we have shifted a lot of the funding to debt.

We feel the runaway credit card spending needs to stop now. It has gotten out of hand. That is our opinion, why must you attack us and call us names because we have offered a different solution for funding the airport project. Is that "open government"? Does "open government" mean belittling anyone who has a different opinion.
Once again, we are offering to work together with Mayor & Council and the Fiscal Oversight Committee to find a long term solution to the debt problem and budget complilations. So far we have not been given any response.

Date: 04:32 PM Jan 20, 2008

The Great and Powerful Oz says hat the school came in on time and on budget. Ignore that man in the corner!

*** Just because the State came in and has forced a forensic audit to determine where all the money meant means nothing!

*** Just because school taxes went thru the roof means nothing!

*** Just because there were millions of dollars means nothing!

*** Just because Jimmy Bertino voted for ethics charges to be filed means nothing!

Everything went great at the school. Hammontonians, shut up and pay those taxes!

Admin · Status: Offline

Anonymous wrote:

The Great and Powerful Oz says hat the school came in on time and on budget. Ignore that man in the corner!

*** Just because the State came in and has forced a forensic audit to determine where all the money meant means nothing! The audit you speak of haqd nothing to do with the building project and you know it. That came much later in response to the deficit spending by the current board. They have now fixed that problem.

*** Just because school taxes went thru the roof means nothing!
You know as well as every taxpayer knows that the increase in school taxes came from the failure by the state to fund the schools according to state law.

*** Just because there were millions of dollars means nothing! I don't know what this statement means.

*** Just because Jimmy Bertino voted for ethics charges to be filed means nothing! Jimmy's not right all of the time and he was proven wrong along with the rest of council because the charges were found to have no merit and were completely dismissed. This was just a waste of taxpayer money.

Everything went great at the school. Hammontonians, shut up and pay those taxes!

Why are you bashing the schools instead of just offering your opinion on what this thread is all about. We have a fantastic state of the art high scholl we can be proud of and you just insult the students, faculty and administration by bashing it.

Date: 06:22 AM Jan 21, 2008

This constant push by HF to get County, State and Federal Grant money is crazy! We never got all this money before and everything could stay the same. Now, this grant money comes in and things are constantly being fixed. I dont like that. It was better before HF when Hammonton rarely got these grants. Back then, when something needed fixing, taxes were raised or else it just wasnt done.

Now, Hammonton gets the Federal Government to pay 95% of the bill for this airport project. The new sidewalks downtown and most of the new roads were paid for by grant money that Hammonton received.

This is terrible! All this progress and taxes stay the same. The debt goes down and the surplus goes up. I don't like this! It needs to stop now!

Date: 06:26 AM Jan 21, 2008

There are things everyone can agree on

Date: 07:43 AM Jan 21, 2008

Republicans push to raise our taxes!

Date: 07:46 AM Jan 21, 2008

Anonymous wrote:
The Hammonton News published the following this week. The Republicans want to raise the taxes again!

County Executive: Tax hike likely

By ROBIN BUEHLER
Staff Writer
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ATLANTIC CITY Atlantic County Executive Dennis Levinson predicted Tuesday that 2008 would be a critical year for the county, at least from a financial standpoint.

Pointing to rising pensions, health care, energy and utilities costs, in addition to the recent tax appeal in Atlantic City with Trump Entertainment Resorts, the county executive said county taxes would likely go up this year.

But by how much has not yet been revealed.

While the county executive traditionally has presented the budget to the Board of Chosen Freeholders by mid-January, Levinson is waiting for the Division of Local Finances to issue its final guidelines on how to calculate the second cap requirement on the county budget.

Levinson noted that, when the budget is presented, the financial document will come in $2 million below cap.

During a prepared speech on the countys financial picture for 2008, Levinson said Tuesday that the county tax rate would increase by 4.2 percent because of the tax appeal settlement with Trump Entertainment Resorts.

Levinson speculated that percentage could increase because of two more casino-related tax appeals that are in the works.

If it wasnt for these appeals, we believe there would have been another two-cent (county tax) decrease, Levinson said during the Board of Chosen Freeholders Tuesday meeting.

For the past several years, the county budget had been introduced with a lower county tax rate than the previous year.

But Levinson said Tuesday that revenues in both the clerks and sheriffs offices have also been down, which will have an affect on the 2008 budget.

Operating the Atlantic County Jail will also cost the county more, Levinson stated, because the state has agreed to reduce the number of state inmates housed at the county facility.

The jail was built house 425 inmates, but has held up to 1,123, some of whom were state prisoners.. The state reimbursed the county approximately $68 a day per inmate.

The loss of state prisoners could cost the county $1 million in reimbursements.
Fuel costs have also increased by 12 percent, or $630,000.

The county is anticipating higher than average increases in pensions, health care, utility and energy costs.

Additionally, the county faces contract negotiations with 12 of unions, four of which are within the Department of Public Safety, Levinson noted.

From what you can see, without any new programs, these increases add up to $11 million, Levinson said.

Levinson cautioned freeholders to think hard before proposing staff cuts, saying the county staff is already thin.

Weve frozen or eliminated vacated positions where possible, he said.
.
When I became county executive, four individuals were in the (Department of) Community Affairs. Now there are two.

Originally published January 15, 2008

Seems like Bertino, Marino, and Vitalo aren't the only Republicans screaming for more spending and taxes.

Date: 08:11 AM Jan 21, 2008

RE: Mayor & Council to add more to our debt.

Admin · Status: Offline

Anonymous wrote:

This constant push by HF to get County, State and Federal Grant money is crazy! We never got all this money before and everything could stay the same. Now, this grant money comes in and things are constantly being fixed. I dont like that. It was better before HF when Hammonton rarely got these grants. Back then, when something needed fixing, taxes were raised or else it just wasnt done.

Now, Hammonton gets the Federal Government to pay 95% of the bill for this airport project. The new sidewalks downtown and most of the new roads were paid for by grant money that Hammonton received.

This is terrible! All this progress and taxes stay the same. The debt goes down and the surplus goes up. I don't like this! It needs to stop now!

Your sarcasm is a waste of time. Even this particular grant you are boasting about at the airport was applied for a long time ago before HF got in to office. Just another case of you taking the credit for someone else's hard work. But, yes we should all be working to get any money that is available from any source to help our town. But don't make it sound like we rarely got these grants. We as a Town have been getting grants all along for many projects.

But the truth is our debt has skyrocketed and our surplus is nearly depleted.

But the facts still remain the same. As with most grants, Hammonton has a portion of the project we are required to fund. In this case it is 5%. In order to float the bond Hammonton must put up 5% of the total amount leaving a balance of $21,375 that we are adding to our debt. We have the money to fund this project without paying interest on it. Let's do the right thing for us, our seniors and our children and keep this from costing us 15 years of payments.

-- Edited by Admin at 08:33, 2008-01-21

Date: 10:07 AM Jan 21, 2008

admin
we bond for our share of grants all the time even way back when the dems had control of the town. as trival as it may seem, if you add up all the bonded grant money for the year it does not amount to much. the debt is for town hall just like the debt for the new school etc.

Admin · Status: Offline

So you are saying there is never a point that we should stop doing this? We have two large expenses that we are paying off at the school and the town hall, shouldn't that have some effect and change the way we always did business? These expenses were necessary and approved by the taxpayers. Those are the kind of projects we need to incur debt with, not small $21,000 costs. The debt we have is not just these two items though. We bond all of our road programs, the new trash trucks, and many others. We are looking at new projects that will add to the debt such as municipal parking lots, Boyer Avenue recreation, parking improvements at the Lake, senior community center, additional airport improvements, historic distric, Little Italy, new fire equipment, demolition of old town hall, paving of 2nd St and Vine St., Fourth Street reconstruction, Bellevue Avenue reconstruction, etc. We need to start planning ahead. We have to start putting money away for our share of these projects once we commit to them. We knew this airport project was coming a long time ago, but we did nothing to prepare for our share of the costs and now we want to go in debt further because of our lack of planning. Through all of the years and all of the projects we all agreed to move forward, but now we must change our thinking because we can not afford to continue to put off our expenses for 10, 15 or 30 years. Let's cut up the credit card and find better ways to manage our town. We are in just as bad a situation as the State and look at what it is going to cost to fix the State finances. We don't have all of the different income sources like the State does, we only have one and so someday soon it will hit our property taxes real hard.

Date: 04:41 PM Jan 21, 2008

Yes, HF has done nothing at all in their two years of office. Everything was done by the same R's and D's who couldn't decide for years which hand to use to pick their noses.

Admin · Status: Offline

No one has said HF has done nothing in 2 years!

Date: 09:41 PM Jan 21, 2008

well admin at least you admit it . hf it's all good.

Date: 11:23 PM Jan 21, 2008

The documents that the Admin posted at http://www.geocities.com/james_maclane/bondissue on this subject show a balance of $7.3M on December 31, 2005, the day before HF took over. A year later the total shows to be $6.7M. The data posted backs up the mayor's statement that debt was reduced by about $570K.

Date: 11:56 PM Jan 21, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Yes, HF has done nothing at all in their two years of office. Everything was done by the same R's and D's who couldn't decide for years which hand to use to pick their noses.

Come on now, you know the Mayor said we should have unity. People are just trying to point out that simply just incurring more and more and more debt is bad for Hammonton. Control spending, yes, Stabilize taxes, yes, Borrow beyond our means, NO NO NO!

Date: 06:44 AM Jan 22, 2008

Anonymous wrote:
The documents that the Admin posted at http://www.geocities.com/james_maclane/bondissue on this subject show a balance of $7.3M on December 31, 2005, the day before HF took over. A year later the total shows to be $6.7M. The data posted backs up the mayor's statement that debt was reduced by about $570K.

The truth comes out. GREAT JOB HF! Taxes down and debt going down too!

Date: 06:47 AM Jan 22, 2008

Jerry Vitalo, showed his true colors at the meeting last night. Last year he was all buddy buddy with the 1sters and now he wants to beat them up.What is it? Now the Mayor puts him on an important committee such as COAH, this truly concerns me.What type of game is he playing, why all of a sudden is he so out spoken. Why does he feel he has to add a comment to everthing? Does he understand that all the things he bitched about on the bill list he voted for last meeting to get done? I hope that the people of Hammonton see the game he is playing, what a joker he is, anyone but Vitalo in November.

Admin · Status: Offline

Anonymous wrote:

The documents that the Admin posted at http://www.geocities.com/james_maclane/bondissue on this subject show a balance of $7.3M on December 31, 2005, the day before HF took over. A year later the total shows to be $6.7M. The data posted backs up the mayor's statement that debt was reduced by about $570K.

That is not what this document shows. The document you are refering to shows the notes and bonds that have been authorized by council but not sold yet. In other words, this is debt already approved by council but it is not actually listed as debt yet because we have not sold the bonds yet, we have not actually incurred the debt yet. When we actually sell these bonds is when this amount moves to and adds to our total debt.

Admin · Status: Offline

I did make a statement to Mayor & Council last night and proposed the alternative funding I have discussed in this thread, but it fell on deaf ears, they still voted unanimously to add to the debt.

Date: 10:43 PM Jan 22, 2008

Admin wrote:
Anonymous wrote:

The documents that the Admin posted at http://www.geocities.com/james_maclane/bondissue on this subject show a balance of $7.3M on December 31, 2005, the day before HF took over. A year later the total shows to be $6.7M. The data posted backs up the mayor's statement that debt was reduced by about $570K.

That is not what this document shows. The document you are refering to shows the notes and bonds that have been authorized by council but not sold yet. In other words, this is debt already approved by council but it is not actually listed as debt yet because we have not sold the bonds yet, we have not actually incurred the debt yet. When we actually sell these bonds is when this amount moves to and adds to our total debt.

This nonsense about complaining that the independent auditor is wrong when he said debt went down sounds like it comes from the Jerry Vitalo School of Finance.

Admin · Status: Offline

No one said the independent auditor is wrong. We agree that as of 12/31/06 the debt did go down. But there are outstanding approved projects that the bonds have not been sold yet and therefore are not in the total debt figure yet. As a matter of fact, those figures also come from the same auditor, so again we agree with him.

Date: 09:44 AM Jan 23, 2008

Jim, I think you are accidentally double counting, which is were the confusion is.

When a bonding ordinance is passed, the full amount of the ordinance is added to the town's debt. Thus, the full $5.9M of the town hall is already added into the town's debt. As the project starts, the town takes our BAN (bond anticipation notes) which are like construction loans. Only when the project is completed are the final bonds sold. However, the total $5.9M was already in the debt calculations from day one of the project.

Why is it done this way? So that municipal bond investors know exactly how much a town is borrowing. If the town is adding a lot of new projects, the investors get to see the full debt load when all the projects are complete.

So why is the town's debt going down? Just like when you make mortgage payments for your house, as time goes on your pay down principal until that is totally paid off. If you don't borrow more equity out of your house than you are paying off, your debt goes down.

How are new projects getting completed with little debt? Most of the projects are paid in part or in full by grants. Even if the town has to pay 5%, that isn't much compared to the payments being made on the existing bonds.

So overall debt is going down while at the same time a lot of nice projects are getting done. That is a good thing, yes?

Date: 11:23 AM Jan 23, 2008

bravo you have explained it to them. they will not listen . three in a row no taxe increase . bonding is how all towns are run. not to say that change is good but the only way to pay this stuff without bonding is huge tax increases. however you must be very careful not to over bond and afect the bond rating.
jerry and anthony the financial team . jerry's school of finance. it could be like the school of rock. the question is can jerry sing and dance like jack black.

Admin · Status: Offline

I stand corrected. I am willing to admit when I am wrong. I received some bad information from a source that I thought had done the research. I have checked with the Town accountant and he has given me the correct information.
But I am still very concerned with the way we are putting ourselves deeper in debt.
We finished 2006 with a debt of $18,277,321.37. That is the number the Mayor is quoting as a decrease from the previous year, and he is correct.
Since the end of 2006 we have added the following debt:

Trash Truck                             $247,000
Firefighting Gear                            4,744
Various Capital Improvements     632,700
Central Ave Improvements          332,500
Boyer Ave. Rec. Fields                  76,000
Airport Runway #3                       21,375

Total                                      $1,314,319

During 2007 we made payments against the debt of $450,005.32

That gives us a net increase in the debt of $864,313.68

Our new debt figure is $19,141,635.05

That is still a pretty hefty debt figure and will take us a long time to pay it off.
Someone commented that all towns run by selling bonds. Well, so does the State and look at the disaster the State is facing now. We need to make sure we are not putting ourselves in the same situation.
Currently we are spending approximately $1,250,000 a year to pay off our debt. If we didn't incur this debt we could certainly use that money in many other places. It equals about 15 cents in our tax rate.
I certainly am not saying we can live without debt at all, but we need to begin to be more selective in how we use it. A project like the Town Hall certainly needs to be bonded, but fixing roads which is a recurring charge year after year needs to be budgeted for. And we certainly should be able to find money in our General Funds to pay small amounts like $4,744 and $21,375 listed above. I gave Council a source to pay for the Airport bond so that we did not incur any debt at all on that project, but they did not listen.

Date: 04:19 PM Jan 23, 2008

admin. wow that's not 25mil. and i think the county is picking up central unless that's our part. ? you are right about the smalll figures. to due alway with bonding would be great however very unrealalistic.

Admin · Status: Offline

The Central Avenue figure is just our portion of the project. The whole project was well over $1.25 million.

Date: 07:27 PM Jan 23, 2008

Admin wrote:

I stand corrected. I am willing to admit when I am wrong. I received some bad information from a source that I thought had done the research. I have checked with the Town accountant and he has given me the correct information.
But I am still very concerned with the way we are putting ourselves deeper in debt.
We finished 2006 with a debt of $18,277,321.37. That is the number the Mayor is quoting as a decrease from the previous year, and he is correct.
Since the end of 2006 we have added the following debt:

Trash Truck                             $247,000
Firefighting Gear                            4,744
Various Capital Improvements     632,700
Central Ave Improvements          332,500
Boyer Ave. Rec. Fields                  76,000
Airport Runway #3                       21,375

Total                                      $1,314,319

During 2007 we made payments against the debt of $450,005.32

That gives us a net increase in the debt of $864,313.68

Our new debt figure is $19,141,635.05

That is still a pretty hefty debt figure and will take us a long time to pay it off.
Someone commented that all towns run by selling bonds. Well, so does the State and look at the disaster the State is facing now. We need to make sure we are not putting ourselves in the same situation.
Currently we are spending approximately $1,250,000 a year to pay off our debt. If we didn't incur this debt we could certainly use that money in many other places. It equals about 15 cents in our tax rate.
I certainly am not saying we can live without debt at all, but we need to begin to be more selective in how we use it. A project like the Town Hall certainly needs to be bonded, but fixing roads which is a recurring charge year after year needs to be budgeted for. And we certainly should be able to find money in our General Funds to pay small amounts like $4,744 and $21,375 listed above. I gave Council a source to pay for the Airport bond so that we did not incur any debt at all on that project, but they did not listen.

It's an honest mistake, no big deal. Remember, when HF came into office at the beginning of 2006 there was about $18.8M in debt which you can also verify from the auditor's report.

I think you will see that when the audit comes out for the end of 2007 the debt was reduced because you have to figure in principal payments.

However, even before you do that, your calculations now show that the debt would be $19.1M. So what your numbers are saying is all the projects of the last two years were done for a total $300K in debt.

While we still need to see if you are right, and I believe you'll be pleasantly surprised and the debt is lower, that is not a lot of money for all the new streets, new sidewalks, etc. Wouldn't you agree?

Admin · Status: Offline

Unless the figures the town accountant gave me were wrong, you can see I have already included the principal payments in my calculations.

Date: 12:33 PM Jan 24, 2008

you talked to town acct? sounds like hf takes open govt serious. the debt never went up that was all a lie. there was no $25 million debt. projects were done with grants things are great and taxes staying down.

Admin · Status: Offline

The debt DID gp up, we were just mistaken on how high the debt went. We are still concerned about $19.1 million in debt. We still need to stop adding to the debt. In just this past year we added $864,313.68 to our debt. We need to plan ahead and stop using our credit card style of spending.

Date: 01:01 PM Jan 24, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Admin wrote:

I stand corrected. I am willing to admit when I am wrong. I received some bad information from a source that I thought had done the research. I have checked with the Town accountant and he has given me the correct information.
But I am still very concerned with the way we are putting ourselves deeper in debt.
We finished 2006 with a debt of $18,277,321.37. That is the number the Mayor is quoting as a decrease from the previous year, and he is correct.
Since the end of 2006 we have added the following debt:

Trash Truck                             $247,000
Firefighting Gear                            4,744
Various Capital Improvements     632,700
Central Ave Improvements          332,500
Boyer Ave. Rec. Fields                  76,000
Airport Runway #3                       21,375

Total                                      $1,314,319

During 2007 we made payments against the debt of $450,005.32

That gives us a net increase in the debt of $864,313.68

Our new debt figure is $19,141,635.05

That is still a pretty hefty debt figure and will take us a long time to pay it off.
Someone commented that all towns run by selling bonds. Well, so does the State and look at the disaster the State is facing now. We need to make sure we are not putting ourselves in the same situation.
Currently we are spending approximately $1,250,000 a year to pay off our debt. If we didn't incur this debt we could certainly use that money in many other places. It equals about 15 cents in our tax rate.
I certainly am not saying we can live without debt at all, but we need to begin to be more selective in how we use it. A project like the Town Hall certainly needs to be bonded, but fixing roads which is a recurring charge year after year needs to be budgeted for. And we certainly should be able to find money in our General Funds to pay small amounts like $4,744 and $21,375 listed above. I gave Council a source to pay for the Airport bond so that we did not incur any debt at all on that project, but they did not listen.

It's an honest mistake, no big deal. Remember, when HF came into office at the beginning of 2006 there was about $18.8M in debt which you can also verify from the auditor's report.

I think you will see that when the audit comes out for the end of 2007 the debt was reduced because you have to figure in principal payments.

However, even before you do that, your calculations now show that the debt would be $19.1M. So what your numbers are saying is all the projects of the last two years were done for a total $300K in debt.

While we still need to see if you are right, and I believe you'll be pleasantly surprised and the debt is lower, that is not a lot of money for all the new streets, new sidewalks, etc. Wouldn't you agree?

The town got all these new projects for only $300K and the rest in grants. That is pretty good. Too bad we had to bond over $20M to get a new school. Maybe HF would have saved money there to.

Did the same guy who said the debt was $25M also say that the school was on time and on budget? Making a $6 million adding mistake might be the reason the school had to leave almost exactly that amount to make ends meet. Maybe the school tax increase was because the schoool went over budget but no one knew they were adding wrong.

Admin · Status: Offline

No it wasn't the same person and your information on the school is just your propaganda.
You've said it so many times now, you even believe it. You always tell others to go to Town Hall to get information, well go to the Schol's Business Office and get the truth.

Admin · Status: Offline

And yes we had to bond to build the new school. It's just like bonding to build the new Town Hall. And if you recall, I have agreed that projects such as those are the kinds of things that should be bonded. The difference in price is the difference in the size of the building and what goes in it.

Also, are you saying that because Mayor & Council took one good step forward by reducing the debt in 2006, it is OK to take two steps backwards in 2007 by increasing the debt to the largest level in our history?

Date: 02:15 PM Jan 24, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

Admin wrote:

I stand corrected. I am willing to admit when I am wrong. I received some bad information from a source that I thought had done the research. I have checked with the Town accountant and he has given me the correct information.
But I am still very concerned with the way we are putting ourselves deeper in debt.
We finished 2006 with a debt of $18,277,321.37. That is the number the Mayor is quoting as a decrease from the previous year, and he is correct.
Since the end of 2006 we have added the following debt:

Trash Truck                             $247,000
Firefighting Gear                            4,744
Various Capital Improvements     632,700
Central Ave Improvements          332,500
Boyer Ave. Rec. Fields                  76,000
Airport Runway #3                       21,375

Total                                      $1,314,319

During 2007 we made payments against the debt of $450,005.32

That gives us a net increase in the debt of $864,313.68

Our new debt figure is $19,141,635.05

That is still a pretty hefty debt figure and will take us a long time to pay it off.
Someone commented that all towns run by selling bonds. Well, so does the State and look at the disaster the State is facing now. We need to make sure we are not putting ourselves in the same situation.
Currently we are spending approximately $1,250,000 a year to pay off our debt. If we didn't incur this debt we could certainly use that money in many other places. It equals about 15 cents in our tax rate.
I certainly am not saying we can live without debt at all, but we need to begin to be more selective in how we use it. A project like the Town Hall certainly needs to be bonded, but fixing roads which is a recurring charge year after year needs to be budgeted for. And we certainly should be able to find money in our General Funds to pay small amounts like $4,744 and $21,375 listed above. I gave Council a source to pay for the Airport bond so that we did not incur any debt at all on that project, but they did not listen.

It's an honest mistake, no big deal. Remember, when HF came into office at the beginning of 2006 there was about $18.8M in debt which you can also verify from the auditor's report.

I think you will see that when the audit comes out for the end of 2007 the debt was reduced because you have to figure in principal payments.

However, even before you do that, your calculations now show that the debt would be $19.1M. So what your numbers are saying is all the projects of the last two years were done for a total $300K in debt.

While we still need to see if you are right, and I believe you'll be pleasantly surprised and the debt is lower, that is not a lot of money for all the new streets, new sidewalks, etc. Wouldn't you agree?

It is nice to see the truth come out. HF is doing a great job keeping taxes down and getting projects done with almost all grant money.

Date: 12:02 AM Jan 28, 2008

Anonymous wrote:

It is nice to see the truth come out. HF is doing a great job keeping taxes down and getting projects done with almost all grant money.

Speaking of Truth did HF spend more or less than $60,000 in the last election?

3rdGENDEM · Status: Offline

hf HAS DONE NOTHING TO KEEP TAXES THE SAME. The school taxes have always been the problem. Now the state has funded the school properly our taxes have stabalized. It looks like Bobby C and Jimmy Mac were right. WE have a state of the art school finished on time and on budget and the state and waterford people are paying for it. Can HF bullies say the same about the town hall and the beautiful community center down the lake. My fear is: that with all the borrow and spending HF has done we will be taxed out of our homes. The bellevue avenue bullies have buried the down in debt.

-- Edited by Admin at 11:29, 2008-01-29

Date: 09:08 PM Jan 30, 2008

Corzine gave the school money this year to lower our taxes. We will see what Loretta Rehmann & her HF cronies do. We deserve a tax cut.